Episode 84: The end of an era
Running time: 44:15
While Rilian and glumPuddle hope to do more discussions with the rest of the council on Narnia topics, this will be the last film news discussion for the foreseeable future. In this episode, we discuss the present status of the franchise, share laughs, frustrations, questions and a few last reflections as we conclude this episode. As an era in the podcast concludes, we on the council would like to give a warm and sincere “Thank you” to all our listeners.
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Which book is the best in the whole series b/c i haven't read any othem yet. But so far I've read about HHB online and it sounds really good so I like to see the film
There's no real consensus on that. Everyone has a different opinion, for different reasons. 'The Horse and His Boy' is my least favourite of the series, by a lot. Others adore it. It's all personal taste. Just read them yourself and decide. But read them in the publication order, not chronologically.
Exactly. Redemption is incomplete without repentence.
Ha! I've read all the books and my favorite is probably Magicains Nephew or HHB! Wow. I do like SC too.
i dont see y walden took so long i mean vdt made more more money than alot of blockbuster movies like captin america, x men first class,and tron legacy. come on walden.
Yes! Very good.
I like SC, LB, and well…..I love all of them! I like MN too!
I really like PC too……….and VODT….let's just say I like all of them…
No, go to the website, they have screenshots of the set, utterly gorgeous, it,s professional theatre, not like a high school play. If you love narnia and can travel to Syracuse, new York, you should see it. As the website says, LWW is rarely produced in the US as a stage play . I'm going soon as it opens. The ice palace set is reminiscent of the movie,s look. syracuseStage.org
A lot of national actors act in this theatre, it,s top notch. Heck, I traveled 6 hours to see the narnia exhibit, I,ll never forget it. Some things are worth the effort! Like Narnia!
How old are you, Dylan, I'm just curious.
No other way too put it! I recently just fiished watching VDT on HBO today, and I think i've come to a coclusion. For all the negative things i have said about this movie, there are also plenty of positive things in this one too. The last 45 minutes of the movie was the best part, they nailed the ending. Overall the movie was a little disapointing, but the last 45 minutes were incredible. I think if they had stayed closer to the book, even with the green mist, just stayed as close to the book as possible, it would have won it for me. Another thing, the special effects were astounding, especially in HD, just purely beautiful. Overall, if I had to grade the movie, it ranks a 6.5 out of 10. Mostly because it did not live up to its full potential. Another thing about the movie that felt odd was the fact that it did not feel like it was in the same series as the other movies, it just wasnt the same.
Well of course. If the movie had been made for $100, and grossed $10,000 it would be considered a big success. It's all relative.
PC didn't bomb at the box office, but it is possible that Walden and Disney did not make a profit.
PC did not do the kind of box office needed to keep the series going strong in the eyes of the studio.
The Beginning of Better movies for the next version of Narnia that go with the books and have better stories, some how go with the book with the LWW remake but make it even better (though I can't see it getting any better though) etc.
That was their own fault, and could have corrected hat with VDT if they "had a little faith"!
The whole series should be animated in a realistic style, that would be fantastic, with no limitations except the imagination!
Sorry I said that so wrong. I know Christ is the one who redeems us. I typed the comment to quick and din't make sure I worded it right. I agree with you guys.
Personally I like the Publication order but the Chronological order is growing on me. If they made the movies in the Chronological order it would feel more like a normal series. With plots that intertwine with the sequels.
Example #1
Magician's Nephew is a perfect franchise starter with the intriguing story, and the evil villain from another world
Those elements can be intertwined into LWW, with the lamp post, showing how the white witch had been spending her time. And then the big finally between Aslan and Jadis in the sequel.
Example #2
LWW is perfectly connect to HHB. Then PC is next! HHB is like a first taste of candy beckoning you to go see what happens to the four children in PC.
The list goes on how much more fluid it goes, and it feels much more like any other series or trilogy. Each books is different and intriguing for different ways but if they did that you could have seen the connections. It feel like their in the right order!
And Finally…
The Last Battle is the Huge finally that all the books were leading to. The End of the World of Narnia and the finally battle between good and evil.
See, if they did it right, and went with the books they could have kept the interest up like they have done in Twilight or Lord of the Rings or any other series. C.S Lewis wanted it to be that way and now I see why!!!!
Forget the $100 example. If 'Caspian' had had the budget of 'Dawn Treader', the film would have come very close to breaking even, for its cinematic run. Perhaps even had turned a small profit. The broadcast/pay-per-view/DVD sales and rental revenue would have certainly put it over the top very quickly. The point is, expectations for it were (and continue to be, in some circles) ludicrous. That's not the film's fault. Again, an adaptation of a relatively obscure children's book outperformed 173 of 188 films in 2008. It's "performance" was outstanding. Its financial management was incompetent. This is not a pedantic exercise on my behalf. It actually DOES make a difference in how the "failure" of the film is perceived. There was nothing wrong with the film. The film reached its audience. The film cost too much money. If, by some miracle, these films go into production again, they must never, ever repeat the financial debacle that was 'Caspian'.
You're right. It IS all relative! Budgets should be set "relative" to the potential of the property to succeed. NOT relative to the success of 'Wardrobe', which will always be in a completely different stratosphere to all of the other books in the series. It's all about perception and reasonable expectations. The lack of both doomed that film, and has killed this franchise. At least for the foreseeable future. Sure, you can say the film didn't perform up to the expectations of the studios. Fair comment. Because their expectations were crazy and reckless. That is not the same thing as a blanket statement that "it didn't perform well", which has been an oft-repeated mantra here for three and a half years. The difference is subtle, but very, very important to distinguish. If the mistakes of the past are to be avoided, that is.
I strongly disagree about people starting the series with 'The Magician's Nephew'. That book is a gift from Mr. Lewis to those already familiar with Narnia. The magic of it is, in my opinion, significantly lost on those who haven't read 'Wardrobe'. It really takes away something from the overall experience of the Chronicles if you read it first. I think it's a huge mistake to do that. Just my $0.02.
Yes, everyone has their two cents and I used to be like you. But after thinking about it I have changed for the reasons I have listed but you can enjoy them in any order cause its Narnia!
Using the VDT music ending as the podcast ending was great. That song is great,too. I just wasn't.t thrilled by h rest of the soundtrack . If they couldn't.t get HGW, I wish they had used the video games composer. New authors I assume, but the music fit perfectly. I wish I had a cd of it.
I don,t think any of that matters, what matters is, is if what IS up there is an enjoyable experience.
Amen", it was never meant to be read with MN first. mN even refers back to LWW . I,d like to spank the people for rearranging it. Surveys show MN is WAY less beloved than LWW. Stupid to start the series off with it .
Expecting it to perform up tp LWW standards WAS bizarre, but so was changing the tone of the series in midstream, from family friendly to teen war film. The BBC kept the tone consistant, the way it should have been. Families are so starved for decent films, they wouldn't have backed off if PC hadn't been chuned out for teenage boys, and the cost of production wouldn't have crushed the project as badly.
@glumpuddle: We know for a fact that PC didn't make a profit. In an interview late last year, David Weil, from Anschutz Film Group, said that they STILL hadn't broken even on it.
I crunched some numbers, just for fun, going on typical studio cuts in different times and places. Based on my estimates, if PC had been made on VDT's budget, it would have broken even with early DVD sales.
You're right though. PC was a big disappointment compared to expectations. They budgeted for it as though it was a sequel to a major hit movie. Industry pundits were predicting that it would perform as a sequel to a major hit movie (much bigger opening than it's predecessor, followed by much weaker legs). One even predicted a $90 million opening. Prince Caspian was a sequel to a hit. Compared to most other such films, whether they are based on popular source material or not, it's performance was very poor.
O, okay, that's fine, I understand- it's easy to make a mistake in these commments 🙂
Every time that I Google it and I click on the website it says it can not locate the page 🙁
Oh gee, sorry bout that. Didn't realize thats not what you meant.
Yeah, LWW is really supposed to be read first.
Yes, MN is like a "behind-the-scenes" of LWW.
Well they had the right actors for the good guys, their script is the only thin that was screwed up. Peter and Caspian were always getting into sissy fights, and since when does Susan fall in love with Caspian? I mean really, SUSPIAN?
MN cant e a series starter because it doesnt act as a series starter, more a behind-the-scenes prequel. And als HHB doesnt belong right before PC because PC was titled originally, THE RETURN TO NARNIA. Clearly a sequel name. Lewis meant for it to be a sequel. Another thing, HHB doesnt even seem like it could be a sequel to LWW, mostly because it has the same behind the scenes feel as MN.
excuse my above mistake i meant BE not E
@Queen C The Gentle: That's a very difficult question, with a lot of easy answers! I find The Last Battle quite different from the rest of the books (and if awards received by a book is a gauge of its quality, then the Carnegie medal won by this book is proof that it's a good one). But every book in the series is a thing of beauty on its own, even to describe one of them as "least-liked" will be a bit of injustice.
@Non-Negotiable: I agree with you 100% on the publication order as the best way to read the series the first time around. A lot of arguments on this topic can be found elsewhere, so I won't give a detailed argument. After the first readings, then the series can be re-read again and again, and this time without the need to follow any particular order. That's how brilliant the whole experience can be.
But having said that, I guess as far as any future screen adaptations are concerned, presenting the stories in chronological order should be the way to go forward.
Why do kids say ya instead of yes now? Is that a reference to a show or something?
Ummmm…. no. Ya is just ya, I really dont know any shows that "Ya" is a catch phrase.
BTW what does HQSB stand for???
Sorry, theres no way someone else is gonna top LWW.
Just for the record, I adore 'The Magician's Nephew'. I REALLY love it. I'm not inferring that it isn't "good enough" to read first. It may be my favourite of the books. It's very, very close, if it isn't. It's a beautiful, wondrous, touching story on its own. It's just that it also has this dual purpose as a companion piece, or a bookend, to 'Wardrobe'. Reading TMN AFTER 'Wardrobe' made me love both books, individually, more. I guess all I'm saying is, you can only read these books for the first time, once. Everyone can decide for themselves, but I REALLY think you'd be cheating yourself out of something pretty neat by having that veil of mystery lifted at the very beginning. I mean, part of 'Wardrobe''s attraction IS that mystery. From the second that Lucy steps through the wardrobe, the reader's mind is instantly assaulted with a million thrilling questions. We have no idea what's happening to her. Is it real? Is she dreaming? Hallucinating? Is her adventure blind luck, or is there a driving hand behind everything? Boy, that's a sad thought, thinking of reading 'Wardrobe' without that thrilling sense of the unknown.
You can always read them chronologically LATER. No harm in that. I listen to the radio dramas in that order. Just, for those who haven't read the books yet, think long and hard, first. There really is something very special you're giving up by going chronologically, the first time.
For my part, I don't see why it has to be one of the two, chronological versus publication order. I think the best way to read the chronicles is as follows:
LWW, MN, HHB, PC, VDT, SC
Anhun, I'm guessing LB is the last in your order.
You mean like Beowulf or Polar express? That type of animation creeps me out.
"Clearly a sequel name. Lewis meant for it to be a sequel."
Lewis himself said that the order probably didn't matter. Now, if you can think of narrative reasons why PC has to come right after LWW, that's fine, but if you argue that there is one "proper" way to read the chronicles based on author intention, that argument doesn't hold.
I personally feel that the longing for the golden age, that we see in PC, has more emotional resonance if you've seen how they lived in the golden age in HHB. In LWW, most of the book is leading up to their coronation, and we only get the briefest glimpse into their lives as ruling kings and queens.
O yeah, I agree. I like the actors, just not their script. Och! The romance between Susan and Caspian was nasty 😛 Why did they have to do that!?!?!?!??!
Ah, no. I personally think the chronicles are best read
LWW PC VDT SC MN HHB LB. Remember, all the the other books happen one after another, almost always happening within the same human year. So the best way to read it is the Pevensie trilogy then SC, which happens immediatley after. Then a little bit of a pause because its seven more years until Eustace and Jill return to Narnia, so during that pause you read MN and HHB, then pick up on LB.
That is true, Lewis may not have chosen a specific order to read it in, but I still think PC is a sequel.
Can I just reminisce on Walden's Chronicles, by way of recalling what IMO are the series' most memorable scenes? Here goes:
1) Lucy Pevensie fatefully ending up in the spare room and how her curiosity started the whole adventures. (LWW)
2) The scenes on the frozen river. (LWW)
3) The arrival of Father Christmas. (LWW)
4) Aslan's death scene. (LWW)
5) The Pevensie children's coronation as the new Kings and Queens of Narnia. (LWW)
6) Caspian's escape from his executioners. (PC)
7) The Pevensie children's return to Narnia via the Strand underground station. (PC)
8) The massacre of the Narnians, after a doomed attempt to raid Miraz' castle. (PC)
9) The duel between Peter and Miraz. (PC)
10) The River God takes revenge in the battle of Beruna. (PC)
11) Eustace's and the Pevensie's arrival in Narnia through the painting of the Dawn Treader. (VDT)
12) Eustace's duel with Reepicheep. (VDT)
13) The attack of the sea serpent. (VDT)
14) The scenes at the End of The World. (VDT)
15) Eustace's and the Pevensie's return to Lucy's room. (VDT)
Just plain messed up.
That type of animation is awesome!!!
Yes.but those scenes you listed in VDT were the best parts of the whole entire movie. Oh! You forgot the dufflepuds! that was a good scene too.
Hey, If you wanna download a lot of Narnia's exclusive wallpapers visit my page… just click on my name.. 😀
hi:
No, it did not "make more money" than those films. Not even close. It got crushed, domestically, by every film you list there. International gross is insignificant, by comparison. It's taking so long because there is no confidence that these films can make money.
High queen shelly belly
dude, I've already seen it, everythings in Spanish er Portugese. Nice attempt at atdvertising on a mostly English speaking website though 🙂
No problem, it's my fault for not taking the time to say it right, but rushing just to reply.
i kind of regret the chronological order I read the books in. I wish I had LWW first, but I already knew the LWW, PC, and VDT stories before I read the books.
Polar express IS creepy. I mean not like Tangled , maybe like Disneys the hunchback of noted dame or the serious parts of Fantasia. Not where the characters are too doll like , or cheap like the 1979 cartoon was.
It's so sad that the narnia series is over, and even though it's the end of an era I think a new beginning will arrive someday, and I will be eagerly waiting.